I am not sure what happened to my original post, but it was gone. 

Just wondering if any of you have problems with getting sound people because of using a digital mixer?


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The reason I was just wondering is because we are in a fairly large church with 1600 or more and we are having a hard time getting people to work in sound. We have never in all the years doing sound have ever had this problem. We always have a lot of great sound people that do sound. But since we have come to this church a year ago to accept the position of Sound Directors, we have had a problem with recruiting because of the digital mixer that they are using.

It is really meant for a studio and not for live sound. You can do anything on the fly and every thing you do, you have to push 3 buttons to get to what you really need. Then our sound people get frustrated because they have fingers always pointed at them because it is not getting done fast enough. Now, I am saying this with 25 years of experience....not with 1 or 5 years experience, so we know what we are talking about, we actually train people on this stuff. I would have not been our preferred option for live sound.

But what do you think digital vs.a digital analog mixer. We are actually going to get another mixer for the main church and this digital one is suppose be going into the studio. So no worries there, but the learning curve is so steep, what do we do in the mean time......? WOW. Puzzled.
We have a Yamaha Digital mixer and I hate it. It absolutely intimidates the typical person who would be interested in sound. It's very complex and non-intuitive. I wish I could go backward in this, but too late now.

That being said, if you know this mixer well, it's a gem. The ability to set scene memory should mean less work for your sound people. In reality, they don't take the time to learn it.
Yes we all have all of that. It is really nice if you have about 10 people that know it really well, we are down to about 6 people in the whole entire church that can do sound on this board, but that is campus wide, and we have 3 buildings on Sunday morning we are doing sound for 2 services, we are spread a little thin for our main building right now... and in the fall we are adding a Saturday Evening Service. WHOOO!
If you purchase your new mixer from a reputable audio company, they should have technicians who will come and train your people on the new board. I would make that a stipulation of where and what you purchase. You may even be able to get a manufacturers technician to come in for a weekend of training. This may also be a good recruitment and orientation tool. Live sound is only going to get more digital, so go with it and get as much consultation as you can. As an alternative, you may be able to send one or two of your people to get trained and then come back and train others. Hope this helps.

al
www.everydaypraise.com
Yes, we have people that train inhouse, the problem is the learning curve, we love the board, but having problems keeping people because of the difficulty.
A topic close to my heart at the moment. Not in church though, it's just that I am standing in for a friend of mine at a music festival later this month and I will be using a digital desk for the first time. Having said that though, the Yamaha LS9 that I will be using has taken me only a couple of evenings to get to know. As long as people are familiar with using outboard effects then what you have on offer is not too different. The hardest thing that I am getting used to is making sure I select a channel before making changes. However I am in the lucky position of being able to borrow the console for a couple of weeks to get to know it. There is no substitute for hands on playing.

In a church setting, a digital desk should be great. The band doesn't change that much from week to week, if you have a dedicated building then almost all effects and EQ settings should remain the same. I do sympathise with the problem that most volunteers on the church PA are not professionals and a change on the scale of moving from analogue to digital can seem like a mountain. In my experience, most of the time the volunteers are just fader jockeys though and really don't know the subtleties of EQ, reverb, comps and gates.

Perhaps it would be helpful to organise some band practices for the sound engineers to practice, where the band just turn up and even if you just sound check all the time. It might be a good opportunity to show your commitment to your sound techs as well.
I'm not sure what the LS9 is like compared to our O1V96, but a lot of the controls look similar. Frankly, the 01V is a huge pain unless you want to be a pro mixer and understand it to the nth degree. And even when you do understand it, you don't understand it. And to do anything, you have to switch between multiple control surfaces, so an emergency change in the service won't be as easy as reaching down and turning a knob.
I think that the LS9 is much simpler than the O1V96. technically I believe depending on what firmware you have in the 01V the sound quality is better because of the higher sampling rate. My friend who owns the LS9 also has an O1V96 VCM and he would tend to keep that for studio or recording work where the best quality is required. I have had a little play with the O1V and I do prefer the LS9.
Interesting - I think the LS9 is significantly more expensive.
For a very good reason. The 01V is a bit of a hybrid it gives some of the flexibility of a digital desk but would still have to rely on an outboard rack for comps and gates etc and there are only 4 effects racks. The LS9 gives 8 racks and also has 2 dynamic effects on each channel. For the gig I'm doing later this month, instead of having to take 20U worth of outboard effects I can make do with 2U, a speaker processor (Which if I really wanted I could do in the desk) and a CD player. If you look at similar products from other manufacturers, the LS9 is competitively priced. The 01V is I think aimed at a different market and not really the live mixing one.
Maybe I'm misunderstanding, but the 01Vs that we have do have comps and gates built in as well as delay which are apart from the built-in effects loops.

Agreed on the 01V not being for live mixing. It's way cumbersome for what we're trying to do and our techs don't make use of it's functions. A less complex unit would get used more fully I believe.
Yes, we do this already, and you are right most people are not sound professionals, but in a live setting, it is very difficult for others who are not digital junkies. Our issue is that we have so many services and things going on in our building and we only have 3 people who really know the board really well, and because of the volume of our services and events it gets pretty intense, and it is not just the services but the rehearsal and tech rehearsals and other events. The one's who know the board work 40 to 60 hours a week, and that is the problem we are having is that not just anyone can run it even a little. We are going to put this one in the studio.

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